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Post by sportf on Aug 9, 2015 0:25:07 GMT
My lifters, in a non-bushed block, leak oil into the lifter valley and my max oil pressure cold is 40, drops to 20 at 1800, then to less than 10 at idle when warm. There is a through hole of .092 in the body and another .092 hole intersecting this in the pushrod socket, and the oil pours out of there. Are these lifters meant to run in a bushed block only? This is with a high volume oil pump.
I read on there web site that they are meant to fit in a "stock oiling" environment. Anybody else have this issue. The engine was ran only for a few minutes and is now back on the stand.
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Post by oldracer on Aug 9, 2015 2:50:43 GMT
Tom , I have the same lifters, did notice a little lower pressure but not like yours, mine is about 20lbs hot at idle but I have duel line milodon with stock pump,when I cross the stripe at 7000rpm it's about 70 psi with 10/30 brad pen oil , I know they pour a lot of oil as I watched thru the dist hole when I primed the motor. you say High volume oil pump , but not high pressure? put in a different spring or shim it. I've heard of people putting restrictors in the lifters but I'd up the oil pressure instead. Russ
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Post by Admin on Aug 9, 2015 4:06:44 GMT
What heads ? Sounds like you have lifters meant for pushrod oiling...Pressure is based on volume/ restriction....if you have a high volume (M63HV) pump, it should maintain plenty....have the part number on the lifters? I run morels(Bullet) unbushed...are your pushrods the right diameter for the lifter socket?Look very closely at the oil band and make sure it is not coming out the bottom or top...
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Post by sportf on Aug 9, 2015 14:05:53 GMT
Push rods fit the socket, heads are Indy EZ heads. You should see the oil shoot out of the lifters (I had two push rods out). It shoots right up through the head and hits a black car 4 feet away. It would have hit the valve cover, but I didn't need that on......
I have taken the high volume pump off the "old" motor and put it on. Now I can get (cold) pressure to 65 psi. I am going to drain this race oil out and put in some 5-10W or so and see what happens. I am still totally amazed at the amount of oil in the valley.
I measured the new "high volume" pump that was on there and the body is the same height as the one I put on (1.730). Stock is 1.500 body height. It may be the spring in the "new pump" is set lower, but I have had a number of melling HV pumps and they always gave me 70 plus. So much for relying on that experience.
I'll update this mess after the thin oil trial.
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Post by rumblefish on Aug 9, 2015 16:39:07 GMT
I had a lifter bore wear to , for lack of a better term, an "hour glass " shape, which caused a lot of oil spraying around the lifter when it came up off the base circle. Wound up bushing the bores, problem solved. I use a dual pick-up milodon, HV Melling pump, and shim the spring to 80# cold idle, end up with 30-40 Hot. standard 10 W 30. I agree with Russ, try a different spring and shim. There has to be some restriction in order to build pressure , also it can cause the pump to " Cavitate " with-out. A pump must pump against " Head Pressure ", or resistance.
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Post by sportf on Aug 9, 2015 17:47:48 GMT
I agree with you guys. Right now I haven't done the thin oil test yet. I am checking the bearings in the bottom, and right now I have a tight number 2 rod bearing. I built this thing and would have checked this then, but right now I have about 0.0008 clearance on this, or so it looks. Got to solve that first. It has nothing to do with the lifters, but a problem just the same.
I was talking with a good friend up at Brainerd yesterday, and he is fighting some race car problems as well. Philosophizing a little, we both agree we are blessed that we "have race car problems" which really aren't life kind of problems.
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Post by Fugly on Aug 10, 2015 3:08:41 GMT
LeMme. make a call tomorrow.....then I need you to call me...
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Post by sportf on Aug 10, 2015 11:04:04 GMT
LeMme. make a call tomorrow.....then I need you to call me... Oh key doh key! I gotta get a rod resized, its egg shaped and tight. The rod bearing was really shiny and checking the clearance its tight. Hopefully I can get this done today.
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Post by sportf on Aug 11, 2015 13:42:39 GMT
Ok, rod fixed and a conclusion: these lifters will NOT work in this block unless the block is bushed, period.
The thin oil test max pressure is 45 psi, and only at certain points. A couple (maybe more) lifters have the oil band (the cut out part) close enough to the top at lift such that the oil pours out of there and pressure then is low.
This didn't show with the thick oil pressure. This was done with 5-20W, the thinnest oil I could find right now. So, onto plan "C", which isn't developed yet.
I am going to guess with warm oil of any grade would give me oil pressure too low to be comfortable with. And if I could turn this over and prime at at the same time I am going to guess (intake manifold off) the oil would be all over the garage!
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Post by sportf on Aug 12, 2015 17:46:52 GMT
Well, got new lifters (with needle bearings darn) and I've got all kinds of oil pressure! On with the plan!
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Post by sportf on Aug 14, 2015 17:44:59 GMT
Well, last update, we are up and running. 70 to 40 psi warm. Once again, this engine started just like TV. Checked the fuel lines for leaks, pumped the carbs till squirts shot, got in, hit the key and up and running, idled as well. Timing was at 45 before, for my guess.
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