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Post by Fugly on Jan 12, 2020 5:58:40 GMT
Respect is mutual Russ, and I realize my opinion is just that....may have misworded the beginner thing, more meant its not necessarily for everybody.-the car should be built for the class not the other way around..my issue is that this class has heritage, which IMO needs to be preserved .What has been done in this particular organization has worked well, where many who change the rules incessantly are not getting the gains one might hope for. I am all for increasing car counts, but I think promotion, interacting with spectators and other racers with the intent of attracting new participants is more likely to gain count than changing rules. I also realize I am resented by some for enforcing the rules, but I did not make them, I was only charged with execution of what was voted on. There will never be a day where 100% of the members and aspiring members will be in agreement as with every group, but , as some have learned before, once you bend things, they get bent more -its a slippery slope.As far as selling the class goes, this class in general is well known for being self sufficient, easy to deal with from a track operators perspective and the fact that it is unique makes it desirable over some others for the tracks. It’s much harder to get booked if your organization has les to offer or is a pain to deal with, again maybe I should have used more words.....I personally don’t care that much about the tunnel ram thing, but I also don’t think its as big an issue as its made out to be for many- the old intakes will run 10.5-11 without much work and would suit many of the cars just fine.My main concern that this class does not get turned into something too far from the intent ...again just my opinion...
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Post by oldracer on Jan 12, 2020 17:28:36 GMT
well said Damon, the only reason I'm kinda feeling for the guy's wanting the intake's is the fact that a lot of guys that race the general progress is to go faster and have more fun, it's kind of hard to do with bandaids the old intakes put on the motor's , almost all are 500 cu in. and larger and need to flow air to make power. that's my take. yes our group is easy to deal with ,car's runs thru program very quickly, the tracks like us, then why does is seem like it's hard to book a race? and why do we always have to be part of a big show? we have such a nice family and lots of fun together by ourselves, years back we raced at Earlville (super fantastic track) we were there with some bracket cars and had a great time racing.the manager walked down the staging lanes and shook everyone's hands and thanked us for coming. what happen to that? Did we get so big that we can't race for the sake of racing?
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Post by oldracer on Jan 12, 2020 17:30:11 GMT
Also , it sure would be nice if some of the other 50 plus members would come on here and say something once and awhile!!!
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Post by rebelrouser on Jan 12, 2020 19:37:13 GMT
I think the main thing to keep in perspective is what is NSS racing? It was started by a group of guys who did not like bracket racing, and loved old super stock style cars. The original idea was full sized, big block, 2X4 cars of the early to mid 60's cars. I am surprised that it took off and did so well to tell you the truth. But nostalgia racing in general is falling off, because all us old guys are , well getting old. Victory NSS has more younger drivers than any other nostalgia group that I come into contact with. Victory format of tacking onto an existing event is the best for most tracks, and promoters, we just need to find events where our cars fit in. And the other big issue is nostalgia events used to be something that small tracks could do to make money, not so much anymore. I talked to a couple track owners at PRI and they simply told me no prep and outlaw racing is where the younger generation and tracks are going to build events to make money to keep tracks open. Having been to a couple events with the street outlaws booked in, and it was kind of telling, when 12 NSS cars had 20 or so old guys really liking our cars and talking about the good old days, compared to the street outlaws tent where the crowd was several hundred to get t-shirts autographed. So what makes NSS racing special compared to bracket racing? For me it is several things, first it is a smaller event, with cars like mine, and people I know and get along with. Sharing an adult beverage, and some good food at every event. Second Index racing and not changing dials every round, I like the challenge of picking an index for the weekend and then driving the car the best I can. No weather stations, air shifters, transbrakes, no delay boxes. Third all the cars have the challenge of using dual 4-barrels. My car slowed down 4 tenths years ago when I made it NSS legal by removing the single dominator and using a chrysler cross ram, but we pick indexes, so what did that matter? Only a little hurt pride on my time slip. I learned, and it went faster little by little. And for me racing my car is only a small part of the fun, building and messing with it is what I really enjoy. I spent 4 days this week to get 5 cfm out of my heads, most likely won't make it any faster, but it was fun trying. I also like the qualifying and pairing of cars, at bracket races, games are played on trying to stage with somebody you think might be easier to beat. So in short, I think growing the Victory group slowly and working with tracks and promoters to find dates good for everybody is best. And finding members and cars that fit in with what has worked for many years, instead of opening the rules and flooding us with cars, that are really old bracket cars. Who in my experience might race a couple events, but will miss their delay box, and trans brake, and move on. I don't think a larger car count will really influence promoters or crowd attendance. Most events now take so long that the crowds even if they had them are long gone by the time the final race is run. NHRA is looking at ways to reduce stock and super stock entries, because they have too many cars to run, in the time they have for the event. Promoters are looking for cars that wow the crowd, not huge numbers. Get a good group of NSS cars yanking the wheels and a good announcer to talk about the history of the cars is still a good format. Something I would look into if I lived in the south is the www.southeastgassers.com/ These guys heads up race nostalgia gassers, and have a technical committee that issues carb restrictors to keep competition equal among the cars. And all cars are 4-speeds. Check out their events on youtube. How neat would it be to heads up race on a budget? And watch the Youtube channel they have large numbers of spectators. What do all the other members of Victory like about the group? That might be the best way to talk about what if any changes need to be made. Easy way to kill it would be to change what everybody already likes.
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Post by oldracer on Jan 12, 2020 22:39:58 GMT
Thanks for you're input Jim.
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Post by Fugly on Jan 13, 2020 0:37:27 GMT
As Jim said, booking on another show is easier and keeps us from having to pay a track or split gate, etc. trying to book races without booking on top of another NSS race or similar and keeping the races spread apart some on dates is much more challenging than it may seem. I for one, would like to do some races at some smaller venues- fans are more active and its something different....
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Post by Mama PolaraBear on Jan 13, 2020 0:42:37 GMT
Hi Everybody! Susie Justice (Mama PolaraBear) I just wanted to put something out there from my view point. I feel so fortunate to be part of this FAMILY we have in Victory. As a person trying to get a car put together (with much thanks to everyone helping me out in anyway!) I have to say yes, rules are not going to make everyone happy and things could be this way or that way but I am very happy they are staying the same (at least for this year). One of the things I like best about this group is that the cars look like they did back then. I was born too late in 1970 but have grown up around cars all my life and these old beauties hold a special place in my heart. George and I used to race two cars every weekend every year at a couple different tracks and i was even fortunate enough to qualify and race at Indy in our division finals. George started my love of drag racing and since he started in Victory my heart is so full and i am excited if the finances and time work out to hopefully get a car together and out there in Victory. My dad used to say if it aint broke dont fix it, you cant please everyone, and if you love what you do youll never regret it. This is all true. I feel so lucky just to have to opportunity to be part of such a great group who all get along so well. Yes, times are changing, we are all getting older but wow! we can get together and have fun. Crowds watching are not too important to me and i just want to race to race such cool cars. I will be the slower one when i get there and grateful that is option as since have not raced in so many years that is where i need to be. What got us back into racing in the first place is that this group is the people and the cars look as they do. We looked around and followed a couple nostalgia groups before we jumped back in again. Our original race cars are too new. We quit racing years ago because of all the BS and such. I am not baggin on anyone and i think great to put out there what you think and any ideas/suggestions, etc. i can usually put my foot in my big mouth without much effort but just wanted to say hi to everyone and thank you for having this group and allowing people to race what they love with people that mean so much. We are VICTORY NSS..
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Post by wwr80 on Jan 13, 2020 2:11:32 GMT
Hello everyone, I usually don't speak up because I'd rather not make waves or whatever but this is an interesting topic. Spectators are getting harder to get out to the track and as someone said it's all about the no prep and heads up street racer, with that said it may be a thing of hitting up some of the smaller tracks and be the HEADLINER for them. Now I really don't want to step on anyone's toes but I don't think changing the rules to allow any more different body styles in is going to help, could ??, but I can be way off !! Alrighty some of you older gentlemen correct me if I'm wrong please, but s/ss of NHRA then and now don't allow the tunnel ram intake. The engine builder and chief tuner would and still do modify and tweak the part's that were and are allowed per NHRA rule's to get the most hp from the engine and driveline,ie aluminium drive shaft, center section, light weight brakes, you get the picture, use what you have and modify the hell out of it inside. Thank you and I hope that we can just race and keep the comradary that we all enjoy !!
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Post by Hollywood on Jan 13, 2020 3:17:03 GMT
Wow , rule changes, Sheetmetal and tunnel ram intake manifolds , dwindling car count , we really have covered a number of different topics over the past three days. Did anyone notice that this topic or discussion has been viewed by over 300 as of tonight. That's a lot people reading what we all have to say. I think that's pretty special that so many people showed that much interest. That said, Dragster Dick at first I was going to agree with you that we should open the door to maybe some different body styles, camaro's, mustangs, novas etc however, after reading what Damon had to say about it and a few others I agree with them. If this was something that was tried before by other groups and failed for whatever reasons it may not be in our best interest to journey down the same road. It's also been said by many in our group that we represent a certain time or era when the big three were slugging it out for bragging rights , Win on Sunday sell on Monday which brings me to Mopar Steve's comment regarding Ford motors. I personally think we need a few more Fords in our group Gm too for that matter. I think it would help to balance out the Mopar vs Ford vs Gm thing. If by allowing the Blue Oval crowd to run a different motor maybe it wouldn't hurt. After all we all know the Bowtie crowd does not use a 396 or 427 motor. I have to agree with Polara Bear George and Jim in regards to wheels up , door handle to door handle racing to the stripe. That with a good announcer to call the races , Alan Reinhart comes to mind. I listened to his play by play from Indy 2019 when Victory NSS squared off with those NMCA boys. It was great play by play, he does in my opinion a great job behind the mic. Looks like we all have a lot to look forward to going into the 2020 racing season or were all really bored sitting around the house crossing off days until spring. It's been great reading what everyone has had to say , keep it up, it's like shinning your car, it's keeps getting better and better and so shall we . We are Victory NSS
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Post by polarapirate on Jan 13, 2020 13:05:25 GMT
This discussion is getting so hot Mama Polara Bear came out of hibernation to join in. A lot of good ideas. I like the rules as they are, personally. We had to spend the extra money to make my car fit the rules, as it is an old bracket car, and you all can tell we aren't rolling in money. One thing that could prove very helpful to new guys and gals that want to race with Victory and need help, is to have a spotter's section in the forum list, as an example, we have classified ads so that if VNSS member John Smith has a carburetor to sell it is posted. My idea is to post things we have seen or know about that is a good deal, such as, I know where there is a 65 Dodge Coronet ex bracket car that wouldn't take much to get it in VNSS racing even though I don't want to buy it maybe someone else out there would. That kind of thing. We can all help the newcomers, and thanks to all of you that have helped on Mama Polara Bears Dodge !!!! Update on it, bodywork is done, ready for primer. I know we have VNSS members that do swap meets, maybe those could keep an eye out for PROPER intake manifolds, for the GM, Ford, and Mopar cars. Jerry, I'm taking you to school here. Pontiac's most famous early 60's motor was the 421 Super Duty and it came out of the factory with 2 X Carter AFBs on it with a nice solid lifter cam. Good old GM dropped support of drag racing in late 1963, all the GM brands, then came the street muscle cars. Arlen Vanke used to race Pontiac's until GM pulled out. Arnie never gave up on them.
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Post by moparsteve on Jan 13, 2020 15:28:17 GMT
George, Arnie raced a D-500 Dodge way back in the day before he switched to Pontiac! He will talk about it if he's asked!
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Post by blang on Jan 13, 2020 16:13:33 GMT
Interesting stuff. I am back into racing again starting the 4th year. (was absent for 35 Years). Well anyway long story short, worked with Russ and built a car for NSS racing with the Victory Group. I bracket race, index race and NSS race with it. I just want to race. So that is what I do. Upon being back in the scene, things have evolved. Parts are better, technology is better, cars are faster, tracks are better and so on. I guess that is what I am getting at. Things change as time goes on. Is that good or bad?, well it depends on how you perceive it. Some want change and others do not. Everyone can be hardcore and hold to their own beliefs, but compromise also leads to great things. Victory NSS is a great group, great program, great people. I also race with the NMCA NSS. Their program is different, their rules are different. Are they better or worse for the sport? Only your own opinion will answer that. I enjoy racing with them and will continue to do so when I can. They did a carb rule change for 2020. How or does it affect things? No idea, but they did it. IMO-It does not matter to me. Cant recall a time that a Quick Fuel, Holley or Edelbrock carb beat me. Don't recall an intake beating me. Its the guy in the seat, in the other lane beating up on me. I know I just need to work on that. What if there were no fans in the stands? I guess I never paid attention to it in respect to who is watching me race. I look at how full the pits are with cars, I look at the fan interaction in the Pits. I enjoy the company of the other racers and fans. And Appreciate we have a place to be able to race. We as racers and families are the fans. It is what it is. Live Streaming, social media, cost and such has taken a lot of Fans out of the stands. it is the evolution of the world we live in. Adjust and adapt to be able to move forward. Looking forward to 2020 race season.
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Post by dennisdart on Jan 13, 2020 17:53:04 GMT
My two cents, I would be Okay with ALL cars from 1959-1969. The era is still represented very well. The real factory wars in Super Stock lasted till 1970 when Pro Stock was formed. The Camaros, Mustangs, and Roadrunners/Chargers were all involved in those wars. Keep 10.5, factory hood scoops, and interiors as we have them now. The intake rule would be loosened up. We still have to run indexes. All those old cars are cool and I know a LOT of people that have some of these cars and really want to run with us.
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Post by cheesecountry on Jan 14, 2020 2:08:48 GMT
I read everything--Dennis is right 59-69--I`m 80--I was there and watch all of them--Including 67-69 Mustang & Camero So who`s afraid of these couple of years? ??----X-member---
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Post by bosspete on Jan 14, 2020 14:32:52 GMT
From What I can see,,,The World Series at Cordova brings out the most fans to the stands and the pits. The kids really like seeing the "lettered up" race cars because that's what going to the races is all about.They look like race cars.The kids and fans love it. This is what draws people to the stands and races. Seeing "real Race Cars" racing down the track. Having some items to hand out to fans is nice too. Some 8x10 pictures,,or a hat,,or even a t-shirt. Just to see the look on a kids face for getting those things is proof enough,,we are appreciated by the fans.We just have to make the show exciting. This is why having some name or lettering on your car will help identify it with the fans who show up.Come on Victory guys,,,we are supposed to be a Nostalgic Racing Organization.Lets look like what we're supposed to be representing. Nothing sells like some "Good Advertisement" You are Victory. Represent it well. BossPete.
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